[Civil]

I was reading that there is going to be a Civic Natural Gas model, and there already is one for the 9th generation Civic. The 9th generation Civic natural Gas does come at a more expensive price point. It starts at $28,225 compared to the $25,525 starting price point of the Honda Civic Hybrid.

I'm a little confused as to what the benefit of natural gas is though. According to this article I am reading, the 2015 Civic natural Gas returns 27 mpg in the city and 38 mpg on the highway. Those are fine numbers, but the 2015 Civic Hybrid returns a fuel economy of 44 mpg in the city and 47 mpg on the highway.With the hybrid getting so much better fuel economy, why does the natural gas version cost more?

http://www.4wheelsnews.com/2015-honda-civic-hybrid-starts-at-25525-civic-natural-gas-costs-28225/

 

[DWils]

Does natural gas itself cost less than regular gas/petrol? Maybe the vehicle costs more upfront but then ends up costing less over the life of the vehicle? Or maybe the high price might have to do with a combustible gas tank and the regulations associated with it?

 

[Civil]

That is a possibility. I was also thinking that it might have something to do with range. Maybe it goes through natural faster than the hybrid goes through gas but because of the capacity of the batteries it is able to travel a lot further.

 

[DWils]

This site: http://automobiles.honda.com/civic/ says that the 2015 versions of the Civic Hybrid and Natural Gas models start at $24735USD and $26640USD, respectively. The Hybrid is rated at 44mpg (18.7kmL) city/47mpg (19.9kmL) hwy while the Natural Gas model is rated at 27mpg (11.5kmL) city/38mpg (16.2kmL) hwy.


The Hybrid has a 1.5L engine (90hp/97tq) while the Natural Gas has a 1.8L engine (110hp/106tq) with both getting SOHC engines.


The Hybrid gets a 13.2gal fuel capacity while the Natural Gas only gets an 8gal capacity.


The two are relatively similarly-equipped with options except the Hybrid does not have air conditioning(?) but gets 6 speakers instead of only 4 in the Natural Gas version.

 

[Dblock]

If I had to choose from either one, I would go with the hybrid...

 

[DWils]

I would too. And then gut it and put a big boy engine in it!

 

[Smith]

Hybrid for sure, especially since it gets 44 mpg in the city and 47 mpg on the highway, which is great for me since this is mainly going to be my commuter.

 

[Dblock]

I would too. And then gut it and put a big boy engine in it!

Lol nicely said...

 

[Smith]

I would too. And then gut it and put a big boy engine in it!

Better ask Ted for the engine

 

[liquid squid]

I was reading that there is going to be a Civic Natural Gas model, and there already is one for the 9th generation Civic. The 9th generation Civic natural Gas does come at a more expensive price point. It starts at $28,225 compared to the $25,525 starting price point of the Honda Civic Hybrid.

I'm a little confused as to what the benefit of natural gas is though. According to this article I am reading, the 2015 Civic natural Gas returns 27 mpg in the city and 38 mpg on the highway. Those are fine numbers, but the 2015 Civic Hybrid returns a fuel economy of 44 mpg in the city and 47 mpg on the highway.With the hybrid getting so much better fuel economy, why does the natural gas version cost more?

http://www.4wheelsnews.com/2015-honda-civic-hybrid-starts-at-25525-civic-natural-gas-costs-28225/

Cost and complexity. CNG Civcs are produced in limited numbers, they don't enjoy the benefit of scaled mass production as the Hybrid and gassers do. CNG costs a fraction of gasoline, thats where the advantage comes in.

Do your arithmetics, figure out your cost of fuel for both plus your projected/average yearly mileage and you should be able to figure out your cost per mile which from there you can figure your average projected fuel costs and payback time...

The estimated fuel cost for this vehicle to drive 25 miles in a combination of city and highway driving is $1.47 using CNG, based on an average fuel price of $1.93 per gasoline equivalent gallon (121.5 cubic feet).

 

[Dblock]

Better ask Ted for the engine

Lol, nice one...

 

[Pinetop]

Cost and complexity. CNG Civcs are produced in limited numbers, they don't enjoy the benefit of scaled mass production as the Hybrid and gassers do. CNG costs a fraction of gasoline, thats where the advantage comes in.

Do your arithmetics, figure out your cost of fuel for both plus your projected/average yearly mileage and you should be able to figure out your cost per mile which from there you can figure your average projected fuel costs and payback time...

Problem is service is sparse...

http://www.cngva.org/en/home/vehicles-stations/natural-gas-refuelling-stations.aspx

Canada has a network of approximately 80 public refuelling stations located in five provinces. All of these stations dispense natural gas in compressed form at 3,000 pounds per square inch (psi), the pressure which is allowed within the current Canadian codes and standards. The majority of natural gas refuelling is located at existing retail gasoline that have a separate refuelling island for natural gas.

http://www.afdc.energy.gov/fuels/natural_gas_locations.html

780 CNG stations in the United States

which comes first, the chicken or the egg?

 

[Civil]

it seems like this could be something to consider in the future when there is a bit more support for it. Some more natural gas stations as well as more natural gas vehicles being sold will make the option much more attractive.

 

[Dblock]

it seems like this could be something to consider in the future when there is a bit more support for it. Some more natural gas stations as well as more natural gas vehicles being sold will make the option much more attractive.

And more charging plug in stations for all the electric cars...

 

[Civil]

And more charging plug in stations for all the electric cars...

For electric cars, but natural gas cars won't need to recharge, they will need to refuel.

 

[Smartie]

For electric cars, but natural gas cars won't need to recharge, they will need to refuel.

so desu ne...

does the manual specify? >

Infrastructure. This is where Yoshikazu Tanaka, the Deputy Chief Engineer, gets philosophical:

“We need more cars before the infrastructure is established, and we need the infrastructure before the car is beginning to sell. All we can do is provide better cars. Right?”

He looks around the table. Nobody objects, but nobody provides a brilliant idea either to break the chicken & egg logjam. The test drives outside are completed. We all get up and back to work.

 

[Dblock]

For electric cars, but natural gas cars won't need to recharge, they will need to refuel.

Lol you said the samething I wrote and yea I was only specifying on the electric cars not the hybrids nor the natural gas...

 

[DWils]

which comes first, the chicken or the egg?

The egg. Preferably over-easy. Then for lunch I have the chicken.

 

[Civil]

I guess I just question whether we will ever hit a breaking point with natural gas vehicles where there are enough on the road to warrant investing more in infrastructure, or the opposite where there is enough infrastructure that people buy more of them. With the other options that are available I think it will be hard to reach that threshold on either count.

 

[Dblock]

My bet is electric cars, like the accord plug in seems more popular than natural gas car...